Tenebris Nox

Which ones? Genuinely interested.

You’ll forgive me but that’s not evidence of a “crank” (unless “crank” simply refers to anyone who doesn’t share your views). You made the assertion that Murray’s “been many many times more discredited than proven correct”. As I said, I’m happy to have my opinion of Murray changed but you’ve not provided any evidence other than a Wikipedia page which doesn’t seem to show he was “discredited” in the way you think it does. He has some opinions which many people don’t share (Salisbury and Starmer come to mind) but, generally, he appears to me to have stood up for some righteous causes (Assange, Palestine, the influence of oligarchs on Brtitish politicians).

Can you give evidence for your “crank” assertion and that he’s been discredited? I’ve followed Murray over the last 5 or so years and I’ve not noticed misinformation. He’s pretty much on the other side of things than mainstream political opinion but usually what he asserts tends to be the case. But happy to corrected and informed by evidence.

Family. Country. Flag. King. Sunday dinner. The village green. Fish & Chips. God. Now that’s patriotism. Who wouldn’t want a bloodbath to save all that from the fiendish Enemies of England who eat babies and don’t speak the King’s English and whose leader is insane?

Do you mean nazis or German soldiers? There is - if you know your history - quite a difference. But, to answer your question, yes. A bit like British conscripts going off to fight and it being drilled into them to follow orders along with the threat of being shot if they didn’t follow orders. You seem to forget that the Allies also committed terrible atrocities on the European mainland in both wars. I don’t think ordinary people - German, Russian or British - are inherently evil and bloodthirsty in the way you seem to. But I do think that tools like propaganda and patriotism can be used to manipulate and coerce.

A bit like all those young men slaughtered in the World Wars (and about every war, really). When the lord of the manor or the king or your priest tells you to sign up and fight, you fight to defend their property. When foreign armies invade, they’re not after the houses and property of the poor or to take over local communities for some vague reason. They’re commanded to go after after the land and property of the rich (for their king or oligarch). It’s not hard to understand that. But, as you say, you go and do you and die for your abstract country, king and god.

Then who triggered the invasion? A whole race of evil Russians who do it because… because… they’re evil Russians? I don’t think so.

Wars are always caused by the ruling classes whether oligarchs, millionaires, aristocrats or whomever. They don’t end up fighting but leave it up to the ordinary people to give their lives. Those Ukrainians dying are certainly not the rich. Ukrainian rich are all in places like the South of France and LA.

Not quite sure what point you’re trying to make but maybe read what I wrote with a little more care perhaps?

Blue Labour are turning out to be a bit like Farage and Reform. The right-wing media will give them a platform out of all proportion with their actual support… until they’ve had so much coverage that their support catches up. Every time the govt say something they’ll be a Blue Labour comment.

It’s that old idea that you can build weapons in order to get yourself out of an economic crisis. Didn’t seem to work in the run-up to 1914 or 1939 and I doubt it’ll work this time either. But it’ll distract the ordinary man or woman on the Clapham Omnibus from realising how shit everything is.

Anyone sane would agree with you. This is “war” between oligarchs and the very rich. It shouldn’t involve everyone else. I’d like to see gladiatorial solutions to conflicts. Put Starmer in a cage with Putin if they really want to wage “war” on each other. I’m sure most Russians don’t want war and just want to go about their lives like the rest of us.

Great. More money flowing upwards into the pockets of the billionaire industrialists who own weapons manufacturing. Plus the joy of watching their media wind everyone up into hysteria about a war. If we’re really lucky they’ll then provoke a war and cause millions of us to die in the first blasts and then millions more in the radioactive wastelands afterwards.

Ho ho ho. I guess that the mainstream newspapers are also “down the conspiracy rabbit hole” too. Maybe check in with media other than GB News, Talk Radio and Fox.

Of course, in your reality there’s no state infiltration of organisations. No women made pregnant by undercover agent-provocateur-cops. No 2000 groups in which state agents rose to leadership posts. No knighted lawyers who could be used to ensure that a mass leftwing party toed the line during a period of economic hardship. No organised anti-semetic smearing of a popular left-wing politician…

No, it’s a world of everything being how it appears and fairness, honesty and decency. Honest politicians and democratic votes. Oh, to have such a view of politics.

Owen Jones wasn’t actually actually a supporter of Corbyn and was quite public about his criticisms of the possibility of a Corbyn victory (Corbyn’s close supporters regard Owen’s actions as part of the campaign against him).

While Starmer didn’t personally “overthrow” Corbyn, he was part of the internal Labour Party’s milieu that sought to work against the Corbyn leadership during the election. The former British diplomat, Craig Murray asserts that Starmer has always been a state asset/agent and was moved into a position where he would be able to take comtrol of a Labour Party that was moving Left and becoming a mass, popular party.

You have to feel sorry for them, though. Those guys are just asset rich and cash poor… that’s why the UK needs to not tax them so much and, instead, cut the benefits of those sponging disabled and poor who don’t own anything. Those guys are the wealth creators (even though they actually suck the wealth out if everyone else’s lives). Just feel so sorry for them.

Maybe. But RAF is flying surveillance over Gaza for the Israelis.

Breaking news: human jellyfish considers having a backbone.

Apologies for my would-be “appearancism” but have you seen the before and after photos of her? A bit of prison time and she now looks the part of a foaming-at-the-mouth gammon xenophobe doing time at Cell Block H.

I’m pretty much convinced by Craig Murray’s assertion that Starmer has always been a state agent who had infiltrated Labour.